RESOURCES:
Washtenaw County August Primary List of Candidates
TRANSCRIPTION:
Caroline MacGregor: This is 89.1 WEMU. The August 4th primary elections are right around the corner. In fact, absentee ballots have already been sent to registered voters and are being collected. One of the most closely watched races in our region is the Democratic primary race for Mayor of Ann Arbor. Today, we'll be speaking with both of those candidates. Christopher Taylor is the incumbent mayor seeking reelection for what will be his final term. Yousef Rabhi is a self-described Democratic Socialist and currently serves as a member of the Washtenaw County Board of Commissioners. Next hour, we will talk with Christopher Taylor for 30 minutes, but, right now, I'd like to welcome Yousef Rabhi to the studios of 89.1 WEMU.
Yousef Rabhi: Awesome! Thank you so much for having me! It's wonderful to be here!
Caroline MacGregor: Both you and your opponent, Christopher Taylor, say affordable housing is a top priority. What are the first three actions you would take in your first year if you are successful in your bid for mayor?
Yousef Rabhi: Yeah. So, one of the main things that really inspired me to run is just how unaffordable Ann Arbor has become. And that affordability crisis has only worsened over the last 12 years. I have seen working class families and working families, middle class families, seniors getting being driven out of our community, unfortunately, and Ann Arbor is becoming, what I keep describing essentially, as a country club town, where you basically have to almost be able to afford a membership to live here. It's not acceptable. This is not the community that I grew up in. We've always been a diverse community, socioeconomically and beyond. And so, unfortunately though, what we're seeing is this continued investment in the top without investing in housing for the people. If we want affordable housing, we have to build affordable housing. And instead, there's this philosophy of trickle-down housing where the city is pushing basically housing for the ultra-wealthy that most Ann Arborites and people that want to live in Ann Arbor cannot afford to live in. And that trickle-down approach to housing is failing our community. And so, instead of doubling down on that type of approach, I believe that the city needs to make historic investments in publicly owned, permanently affordable housing And the reason that it is important that both of those are met, both publicly owned and permanently affordable, is a lot of the housing that is being touted right now is being affordable. First of all, it's not all that affordable. And second of all, it's not permanently affordable. There's time limitations on the affordability. Those are issues. And we have public land and public resources in our community that we should be using to build publicly owned, permanently affordable housing. For example, the Kline's Lot in downtown Ann Arbor is a prime example where that is public land that is a prime location to potentially build publicly owned, permanently affordable housing. But instead, the City, Council and Mayor are looking to sell that to a private entity to build high-rise luxury condos. I think that's a complete misuse of public space when we have an affordability crisis. And so, one of the first things I want to do is make that investment in our Ann Arbor Housing Commission. I'd like to see an expansion of both the Ann Arbor Housing Commission, but I also want to see us look at creating city-owned cooperatives. I think the cooperative model is really powerful and important when it comes to affordability. We have some co-ops in Ann Arbor that were funded by federal money. A lot of that federal money had a time period that they had to be affordable for, and that time period has since expired. And so, some of them have gone market rate and some of the are staying cooperatives and staying affordable. If we keep public ownership of the land, then we can keep those basically affordable in perpetuity. And the third model I really am looking at is making investments in building land trusts--public land trusts--around housing. And in these types of scenarios, you would basically have a situation where people would be able to buy a house if their income-qualified at a reduced rate. And instead of increasing the value of the property with the market, there would be a capped increase. And so, when the person sells the house at the end, they still get to earn some equity on it. But it is not fully market rate, so it's still affordable for the next person that buys it. All three of these models can be funded through a combination of public funding sources. One of the things I would like to supercharge is the ability of the city to do what's called revenue bonding, which is borrowing money that relies on a revenue source. In this case, either rents or co-op dues or the sale of these land trust homes to be able to then pay the bonds back. It will not result in an increase in taxes because it is solely reliant on that revenue source. And there is a way to do it if we think of the city in a way that can approach housing in a holistic way. We need to build housing for all income scales, including those that are at the very low end of the income scale and people that are, like I said, middle class that are the folks that are working to make Ann Arbor run: the bus drivers, the nurses, teachers who can't afford to live in our community right now, but who deserve a place in the community that they're helping to run.
Caroline MacGregor: Now, Mayor Taylor, he's obviously cited the 600 units of affordable housing that he said his administration has implemented in the first 200 years of the city's history, also 1200 units of new affordable, permanent affordable housing. What's wrong with that affordable housing? I mean, that's going to be available for working-class people too.
Yousef Rabhi: Some of it might be, and I have supported most of that housing. Actually, there's an example recently of a brownfield project that came through with the City of Ann Arbor. I believe it was 300 units of affordable housing. I voted yes on that. I'm very proud to support that that project moving forward. I'm also responsible for pushing along the Platt Road project in Ann Arbor, which resulted in 50 new units of affordable housing. And so, I've been at the table for a lot of those things that he's touting as successes that he has been able to achieve. I've also been part of, if not integral in, getting those to move forward. For example, the Platt Road Project, I got hundreds of thousands of dollars of state money when I was in the state Legislature because I was a state rep for six years and the Democratic floor leader for four and got hundreds and thousands of in the state budget allocated to the Grove for Avalon on Platt Road to help build those 50 units of affordable housing.
Caroline MacGregor: With regard to the Kline's parking lot.
Yousef Rabhi: Yeah.
Caroline MacGregor: That's what you refer to it as. Chris Taylor I know has stated that there is the allowance for affordable housing on a corner across from the road or there has been leeway for affordable housing.
Yousef Rabhi: The project that they're talking about has zero units of affordable housing. They're selling it to a developer to build 100% market rate and above housing.
Caroline MacGregor: The Comprehensive Land Use Plan, which aims to change zoning restrictions to increase density in the city, the goal is to increase housing stock with more duplexes, triplexes. There has been the issue of displacement raised. But then, of course, the Mayor, he has stated that there was already displacement because of the lack of affordable housing, the supply and demand issue. How do you feel the displacement issue is being addressed?
Yousef Rabhi: I don't think it's being addressed at all, and I think that's exactly the crux of why I'm running because we are seeing gentrification in our community. And it's getting worse and worse by the day. And I believe that, again, if you want affordable housing, you have to build affordable housing. And what Mayor Taylor himself said when they passed this plan is that we would get towards affordability in our in 20 to 30 years. That was his quote that he said when the plan passed, 20 to 30 years. I don't have 20 to 30 years to wait for the market to somehow magically solve all of our problems to create affordability in Ann Arbor. I am going to be, what, 68 years old in 30 years? So, that's not a timeline that I'm willing to accept. We need to accelerate that timeline and build housing for the people in the immediate term.
Caroline MacGregor: This is 89.1 WEMU, and we are talking with Yousef Rabhi. He's the challenger in the Democratic primary race for Ann Arbor Mayor. I'm Caroline MacGregor, and next hour, you'll hear from his opponent, Christopher Taylor. Onto the subject of city services. You argue that residents pay high taxes but are not receiving the level of services they deserve. Where is the city falling short?
Yousef Rabhi: The roads are crumbling--absolutely crumbling. And a lot of neighborhood roads and a lot of larger arterials are falling apart. Our infrastructure is not meeting the demand of our community. And I think a lot people see that after they pay these very high tax bills and then go out on their bike or maybe it's on a sidewalk or maybe its in their car. And they experience these absolutely terrible crumbling roads. The city's also no meeting the demand when it comes to services. Like, the goal of city government and the power of government and the reason I believe in government so strongly is because the whole idea is everybody's pitching their dollars into one big pot and then can more effectively and efficiently provide services to everybody than each individual can alone. And so, how do we find ways to figure out, basically, what are the burdens on people's life? What are the financial burdens? What are the time burdens on peoples' life? And then, how can the city step in to help support people in their day-to-day? One great example of that, like I was just mentioning, is the roads. Let's talk about the roads as an example. So, my mechanic, who I love, mentioned to me the other day that about 30% of his business comes from people who had just hit a pothole in Ann Arbor that then come to him to get their car fixed. That is an expense that Ann Arborites then have to bear because the city isn't maintaining its roads.
Caroline MacGregor: I have to stop you there.
Yousef Rabhi: Please.
Caroline MacGregor: Obviously, potholes are an issue around Michigan. It's famous for "fix the damn roads," as Governor Gretchen Whitmer has said. Christopher Taylor would say that there are multiple projects throughout the city that are taking place right now in the summer months to fix the roads. This is the time it's being done, and people can see cones everywhere. So, there are visible signs that projects are underway to fix the roads. What do you say to that?
Yousef Rabhi: I'd say it's deferred maintenance. You have a situation here where my understanding is that Taylor basically instructed his team at the city that this was the year that they were going to put a lot of shovels in the ground, put a lot of cones out. And unfortunately, it's an election. I mean, the timing is that it's an election year. He wanted to show that there's a lot investment happening, but why wasn't this investment happening before this time? Why wasn't investment happening in our community to fix our roads leading up to this moment? And the reality is, is I voted for the countywide roads millage, which supercharged the ability of our local communities. Ann Arbor gets a direct allocation from Washtenaw County to fix the roads. And so, we should be seeing a lot of these projects. We should have been seeing a lots of these projects in the pipeline already to repair the roads. But the other thing I want to say too is there is a problem that we have at the city, where a lot city dollars that should be going to City Hall to actually fix the roads and provide other services are being captured by other entities. A prime example of that is this Arbor South project that is going to not be paying taxes for the next 30 years. They have a $350 million tax subsidy. This developer will not be paid $350 million over 30 years. That's not paying for the roads. It's not paying to the busses. It's not paying for the libraries. It's not paying for the affordable housing millages. It's not paying for any of the millages that the rest of us Ann Arbor residents are paying. On the one side, they're not paying taxes. On the other side, you have a, what is potentially going to be, a thousand new units of housing, which is wonderful. And those are additional individuals that are going to driving on the roads, using the libraries, using the bus system, using the same services that the developer is capturing the taxes that they're paying, instead of going to actually fund those services. And what that means is then the rest of us are left to pay the difference on the infrastructure that's being used but not paid for by projects like that. Another example is the Downtown Development Authority.
Caroline MacGregor: Okay. Aside from what you've just said, coming back to the issue of, and it might sound simplistic, but the issue visible cones on roads and projects going on in Ann Arbor. If you drive on 94 up to Detroit, there's an enormous amount of road work going on. So, you could blame the election year for that, too. I mean, you're trying to indicate, possibly, that there's more road work, more projects going on, in Ann Arbor due to it being an election year. Well then, how would you explain road projects on 94?
Yousef Rabhi: Road projects are always happening. Road projects are always happening. They've been happening.
Caroline MacGregor: But they have increased this summer.
Yousef Rabhi: They have increased in Ann Arbor because there's an election. I wouldn't say that they've increased everywhere else. I would argue.
Caroline MacGregor: Just Ann Arbor.
Yousef Rabhi: Yeah.
Caroline MacGregor: All right. Onto energy and infrastructure, the city takeover of the electrical grid, too. You've supported municipal power as an alternative to DTE. You've stated DTE prioritizes profits over customers and uses campaign contributions to influence politicians. Is that correct?
Yousef Rabhi: Absolutely!
Caroline MacGregor: Okay. Christopher Taylor says the goal of public power is financially and legally unrealistic in the short run. He advocates for his Sustainable Utility, or Energy Utility, which offers residents renewable energy while they remain connected to DTE's electric grid if they so choose. Opponents, like Ann Arbor for Public Power, which you support, they are concerned about...for our listeners, of course, this is the initiative to amend the city charter to put the municipal power utility measure on November's ballot. They cite concerns about future litigation that could cost taxpayers millions. What do you say about this? I know Brian Gehringer, the Executive Director of Ann Arbor for Public Power, he says residents can already save money on monthly bills that are currently earmarked to DTE to pay shareholders, for an example.
Yousef Rabhi: Yeah. I mean, the reality is we're already paying it. Every month, we pay our DTE bill, except the money that we're paying in our DTE bill is not staying in Ann Arbor. It's going to Wall Street investors. They earned, I believe, it was close to a $1.5 billion in profits region-wide last year. That's a $1 billion-plus that are not being spent to actually maintain our grid. They're also spending money on CEO salaries. Their CEOs are making over $10 million. And so, our money is going to pay these exorbitant salaries for CEOs, and our money is going to pay for lobbyists in Lansing, which I have, as a legislator, again for six years, I had a front row seat to watch the deep corruption that DTE and consumers have on our political system. They are spending hundreds of thousands of dollars, millions of dollars in some cases, to not just hire an employee lobbyist in-house, but they also hire firms that do lobby work on their behalf. And this is all with our money. In addition to that, they have political action committees, and they have their dark money accounts. This is a major area where our money goes is to dark money account, C4 organizations, 527 accounts, that are used that we don't know exactly how much money is going into them or what the money is exactly being spent on. But the money is going to either support or oppose candidates through "educational activities". They educate the voters, but they educate them in a way that is very skewed towards what the utilities want. So, these C-4 and 527 accounts, these are the corporate accounts that you see that when you turn on the TV, and there's a very negative mailer or negative ad, that's what you're seeing is these dark money accounts that are spending for and against candidates. I'm the only candidate in this race that is not relying on a corporate dark money account to smear my opponent. I'm the only candidate in this race that has not taken money from DTE executives. And, yes, at the end of the day, I'm the only candidate in this race that supports Ann Arbor for Public Power because I believe that Ann Arbor needs to go towards a 100% municipal utility. It is the only way that Ann Arbor will achieve 100% renewable energy. We cannot achieve a 100% renewable energy with the SEU alone. The SEU is something that I support. I think it's a step in the right direction, but it is not creating a full-scale connection to 100% renewable energy. It will never get us there, and it will always keep us reliant on the same evil system. DTE is a fossil fuel company. People often forget that. They are not just an energy company. They're a fossil-fuel company. They own and operate fossil fuel infrastructure, including pipelines in our state. They are never going to move to 100% renewable energy because they are reliant on fossil fuels, and they are a fossil fuel company. This $1 billion figure and all the scare tactics that you're hearing from Taylor and others, these numbers are literally coming from the fossil fuel industry-backed firms that are doing research for DTE to put out exorbitant numbers that will scare people against this measure. That's what's happening. And these same companies are climate change-denying entities, and they are pushing an agenda of wanting to keep DTE and fossil fuels at the center of our energy mix here in this community. I say we need to reject that. We say no to DTE, and we need move in a different direction for our community to achieve reliable power and to achieve 100% renewable energy.
Caroline MacGregor: We continue our conversation with Yousef Rabhi on 89.1 WEMU. I'm Caroline MacGregor. And next hour, we will hear from his opponent, Christopher Taylor, who is the incumbent in the Democratic primary race for Ann Arbor. Yousef, you just raised the issue of dark money, so we'll go back to the issue of the dark money mailers. So, a mailer landed in Ann Arbor mailboxes with red X's. Tell me about these mailers, if you would.
Yousef Rabhi: So, it's not just mailers. They have mailers hitting. They have text messages going out. They have TV ads. This is a corporate dark money account. Nobody knows where the money's coming from. Nobody knows how much money they have. And this is, unfortunately, a part of our political system that has been going on for too long. I actually introduced legislation in Lansing to try and curtail the ability of these dark money accounts to influence our elections. They are the core of corruption in our political systems. And what is happening here, I believe, is that there are corporate actors that are aligned with Christopher Taylor's agenda that are dumping large sums of money into a dark money account to try and smear my good name in the community. And what they're talking about, what these red X's are, is they're taking about my voting record as a state legislator primarily. And I want to make it very clear with the listening public that what they're saying on these mailers are lies--straight-out lies. What they are talking about are not actually what these bills do. I'm going to give you guys an example. One is there was a text sent out recently that said, "Yousef Rabhi opposed legislation to protect Michiganders from radioactive waste." That is a lie. That bill and the bill that it was tie-barred to were bills to allow radioactive waste to be dumped in Michigan. If you've heard about the Van Buren landfill and the fight that they had in Western Wayne, against T-norm and the radioactive waste from hydraulic fracking and the radioactive waste from the Manhattan Project being dumped in Michigan, the only reason that that was being considered and allowed is because of that bill that I voted against. So, this dark money group is lying about what the bill does. I absolutely voted no, but the bill did not protect people from radioactive waste. It endangered people from radioactive waste. And if you go down the list of every single one of those bills, these are bills that were largely Republican-sponsored, that were pushed by industries that stand to benefit from the bill passing. They were not bills that protected public health. And anybody, like this dark money account, can spin the vote any way they want to, and they have the money and resources to lie to the voters. And so, we are basically calling on our supporters to make contributions to our campaign to help us counteract those lies that are hitting our community, so that we can talk about what I actually voted on in Lansing and what these bills actually do.
Caroline MacGregor: But you have come out quite strongly accusing Mayor Taylor's campaign directly of sending out these mailers.
Yousef Rabhi: He also sent out a negative mail. Yeah.
Caroline MacGregor: But we don't have any proof that his campaign did send these out. Could this not be slander? I mean, you don't actually have definite that these mailers came from his campaign.
Yousef Rabhi: Christopher Taylor's campaign sent, from his candidate committee, a negative mail as well.
Caroline MacGregor: Negative mail. That's not the dark mailer you're talking about though. Those are separate.
Yousef Rabhi: There have been three mailers that have hit. The first one was negative mail from Taylor himself.
Caroline MacGregor: What was that one exactly?
Yousef Rabhi: That was the one with a bunch of red X's and checkmarks that compared what Taylor...
Caroline MacGregor: The one with cyberbullying, adult speech crime.
Yousef Rabhi: That was different.
Caroline MacGregor: That was different. OK.
Yousef Rabhi: But he sent negative mail, too, is my point.
Caroline MacGregor: You know this with a certainty.
Yousef Rabhi: It was from his committee. The mailer had his logo on it with his committee at the bottom.
Caroline MacGregor: Okay. You've been accused of criticizing a specific Ann Arbor city staff member who used to work for DTE. Tell me about this, because that's sort of come back to you as being negative.
Yousef Rabhi: Yeah, absolutely. And I brought that up at the League of Women Voters forum. Basically, it's the fact is they created this SEU to, what I've been saying, to take a step in the right direction towards creating renewable energy in our community. And who did they put to run that? A former DTE executive. That's not slanderous. That is a fact. I don't understand what the issue is there. I mean, why would we put a DTE executive to run a Sustainable Energy Utility in our city? That doesn't make sense to me.
Caroline MacGregor: All right. The campaign has become negative on both sides. Would you say that's a fair statement?
Yousef Rabhi: I would say that Christopher Taylor and his corporate allies are questioning my voting record and my character, and I am attempting to set the record straight.
Caroline MacGregor: Okay. I do want to get to data centers quickly. You've stated that you believe data centers will somehow infiltrate Ann Arbor in a smaller capacity. Mayor Taylor disputes this. He says it will not happen. What makes you think data centers will make their presence known in the City of Ann Arbor.
Yousef Rabhi: Because they're already doing it in Lansing. They have a proposal on the table in the City of Lansing for a smaller-size data center to be placed within the City of Lansing.
Caroline MacGregor: So, that doesn't mean it's going to happen necessarily.
Yousef Rabhi: It means that the data center companies are looking at urban areas to place data centers. And what I have said is we need to be prepared for that as a community. And if we are just denying that it's ever going to happen, that is a very, very short-sighted approach. I am the only candidate in this race that has taken a firm position against data centers. Christopher Taylor has refused to take a firm decision against data centers. And what I have said, time and time again—
Caroline MacGregor: He has said they will not come to Ann Arbor.
Yousef Rabhi: That's not saying that you oppose them coming to Ann Arbor. That's pretending to be able to envision a future where they won't come to Ann arbor. But he has not said that he's against them coming to Ann Arbor. He has not, like I have, that he would support a full moratorium on data centers and rezoning our city, so that data centers can't be located here, which, I believe, is absolutely critical for us to do. I also am the only candidate in this race that's talking about regionalism, that's talking about how we need to look beyond our highway border and go out into other parts of our county like Saline Township, like Ypsi Township and stand in solidarity with the people of those communities who are facing these data centers head on because I believe as anybody who sees this issue should also understand that what happens in these other communities will impact Ann Arbor. It will impact us. The Saline data center is a prime example. Right after the Saline data center got approved just a few months ago, there was a proposal to build one of the largest natural gas-fired plants in the state in Lima Township.
Caroline MacGregor: Right. I was going to ask you about that. Consumers Energy has pulled out of that, of course. It's dropping plans to build.
Yousef Rabhi: They are dropping plans. But up until recently, they were planning to move forward with it, and we would have all been in the airshed of that facility. And so, we would've all been breathing the air from that plant. And that is a direct result of the Saline data center being built. So, we have to understand that what happens outside of the highway boundaries, what happens out of the city limits, will impact us. And we need leaders. We need a mayor who is going to step outside of those boundaries and partner with the communities around Ann Arbor and stand in solidarity with the people of our county, of our state, and create an ethic around regionalism because these issues that we're facing, whether it's housing, whether it data centers, whether it's environment and energy, they don't stop at the highway boundary. They are regional issues.
Caroline MacGregor: Okay. Onto AFSCME Local 369, a labor union representing workers employed by the City of Ann Arbor. They've been working without a contract since the beginning of this year. They're engaged in a dispute with the city over cost of living increases. Taylor said he's tried to negotiate with them, but their requests were unrealistic. The 12% cost of living wage increase in the first year, 12% in the second year, and 12% the third year with additional economic benefits. On top of that, he says it's not sustainable. What do you think is reasonable for this union?
Yousef Rabhi: I think that those are boss talking points coming from somebody who doesn't understand how negotiating works. And I think it's completely and wildly inappropriate for the Mayor and the Administrator to have gone on record and said some of those things. The way that negotiating works is that labor comes forward with a proposal, and management comes forward a counter proposal. And then, they work on finding middle ground. The union fully understands that they're not going to get 12% for three years. That is the opening bid of negotiations. And the fact that they're talking about negotiations in this way as if it were some unreasonable thing shows just a misunderstanding of how collective bargaining works. I believe that the collective bargaining process, if it is done in good faith, will yield the right results both for the workers and for the city. And that's what we should be investing ourselves in an honest way, instead of having this public, sort of rhetorical debate about this. It should be done at the collective bargaining table, and if the city were to come to the table in good faith and work with the workers that make our city run, by the way, when you turn on the tap, these are the people that make sure you have clean water coming out of your tap. We need to make sure that we're treating our workers fairly. They have not gotten a raise in two years, and they've been working without a contract since January. That is an unacceptable place to put our staff in.
Caroline MacGregor: Now you are endorsed by AFSCME, Senator Bernie Sanders, the Ann Arbor Education Association, United Auto Workers, among others. Taylor just received the endorsement of Governor Gretchen Whitmer and Senator Elissa Slotkin. He's also supported by Ann Arbor Firefighters, Ironworkers Local 25, to name a few others. He has stated that appearing on picket lines is not enough. It's doing the day-to-day, boring work to bring services to the public that counts. What's your response to that?
Yousef Rabhi: I'm really tired of Taylor and his allies trying to say that I have not done the work for 16 years. I have served this community in the most boring ways possible and in the most public ways possible. To infer that you can't have a gavel and be out on the picket line at the same time is basically is admitting, frankly that he hasn't been doing the work on both ends. As an elected official, you have to be there for the people. You have to on the picket line. You have be there at the rallies. You have there when there is an ICE protest. You have have to there, and you have be working with staff, doing the behind-the-scenes work that's boring. And I have been doing both for the last 16 years, and I'm proud of the record that I have. So, it's about having a gavel. I have had a gavel before. I've been the chair of the County Board of Commissioners. I've in leadership in the second highest position in the Michigan House of Representatives. And I have still been able to leverage those positions to do good work. And I still have been able to get out on the picket line to support the workers, to support people protesting against the fascist Trump administration and to support our immigrant community from the ICE crackdowns that have been happening.
Caroline MacGregor: All right. Thank you. That is Yousef Rabhi, the challenging candidate in the Ann Arbor Mayoral Democratic primary race. We just spent 30 minutes with Yousef Rabhi, and in the next hour, we'll do the same with his opponent, incumbent Ann Arbor Mayor Christopher Taylor. Primary elections will be held on Tuesday, August 4th. We'll be following this race and much more in the lead-up to Election Day. And then, the WEMU news team will provide you with the election results and reaction after the votes are all counted. I'm Caroline MacGregor, and this is your community NPR station, 89.1 WEMU, Ypsilanti.
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